NOSM - What should I do?

[rkstrach]

Greetings;

I've been following this forum for about a year or so (just after I began looking into NOSM) and I like what I've been seeing. I'm asking that only those who have had interviews and/or experience applying to NOSM reply to this posting.

I'm 20, male, have volunteered at numerous institutions such as: Canadian Blood Services Clinics, Orillia Agricultural Society, Soldiers Memorial Hospital and many others in the medical and health field. I am type 1 diabetic, have been since I was 3. Thus, I have plenty of experience dealing with physicians and medical staff. I am a first year at Lakehead in Orillia, and will be attending Lakehead in Thunderbay for 2 years in 2 years. I love the north, am taking a Northern studies course, and intend on residing in the Elk Lake city, Thunderbay area for the rest of my life. My GPA atm (though we haven't received our final grades yet) is looking like a 3.0.

I am just wondering what suggestions those who have been through the process have, and what might be my shortcomings at the moment. I know you can't explicitly tell me what the interview is like, I respect that, but I am asking that you merely guide me in the right direction.

Any ideas?

[jojoluvsu2]

Where are you from originally? Context is such a huge part of NOSM's criteria, and I don't think Orillia is considered rural (at least not compared to what northern Ontario considers rural). As well, going to school in T-Bay doesn't count for much, it's living/working in the area that will show you truly want to live in the north. Ask ReelBeef, I think he was told basically to live and work/volunteer for ~5 years before he would be considered a resident of NO.

Right now (and I am by no means an expert so others please chime in) you should focus on school and getting marks up. Even if it means dropping ECs to spend more time studying. As many have said, you can always do more ECs but a GPA sticks with you forever. A 3.0 meets NOSM's cutoffs, but still the likelihood of an interview/acceptance with a 3.0 isn't great, even if you did have a great context score and excellend ECs. As well, it'll improve your chances at other med schools. I really want to go to NOSM too, but I'd take whatever school will have me! I'm definitely not in the position to be picky or put all my eggs in one basket, and I don't think you are either.

[chicklets3]

In order to have your best chance for NOSM, you really do need to be a resident for at least 8 years and improve your GPA. NOSM may consider some of the time you spent attending Lakehead U. as time living in the north, but you will definitely need live in the area following graduation for a few years. There are so many terrific candidates who have lived in rural or northern communities for most of their lives who also have GPAs much higher than yours. These people are your competition! I believe the average GPA for students entering NOSM is around 3.6-3.7.

For most of my life, I lived in Edmonton, AB (definitely not rural and OOP to boot!) and this is where I completed my undergraduate degree. I didn't even bother applying to NOSM until I had lived in northern Ontario for 8 years and my GPA hovers very close to the admitting average. Last year I had an interview with NOSM and was placed on the ranked waiting list...but too high to get in. You should plan on applying to other medical schools as well. Write the MCAT soon after you've finished those courses. I wouldn't put all of your eggs in one basket.

[Wayward son]

1) GPA. The average GPA for this year's entering class was 3.72. There is no weighting formula. No dropping the worst year, or weighting upper years more heavily, or only taking the best two years, or dropping the lowest credit if you take a full course load. They look at it all. Chances of getting in with with a GPA 0.2 lower than the average is very slim.

2) Northern/Rural. This counts for a lot. Not sure where you are from, but if you grew up in Shanty Bay...I would be surprised if NOSM awarded rural points for being just a couple minutes outside of Barrie. You would have to live and work in Northern Ontario for several years to build up context points. That is not easy, but can be done, as Beef has shown (and chicklets3 from the sounds of it). Getting into medical school is not a race, but a process, which is often long with many hurdles to be cleared along the way.

3) Of course there are still the essays and your ABS (Your EC's already look decent, but I would drop some if they will affect your GPA). Pre-interview NOSM looks at GPA, context and ABS. 1/3 each. If you score really well on 2 of the three you may get an interview despite scoring poorly on the other category. However, pre-interview you only need to be in the top 400 of 1800 - 2000. Post-interview you need to be in the top 64 of that top 400 (technically top ~ 85 or so as some get in off the waitlist) so it is a whole different ball game and making up for doing poorly in one category is much more difficult. I talked to a lot of the people who interviewed at the same time as I did last year. They were all surprisingly strong candidates. NOSM is in a position to take only the best of the best. This is not meant to discourage you. Getting in can be done. But it takes a lot of work.

4) Don't worry about the interview. If you get one, it will be a very enjoyable experience.

[rkstrach]

Thanks to everyone, you've been very wise. The GPA isn't a problem, I can pull it up yet (I'm only a first year and haven't received my final mark). I need something to improve my context though. I know NOSM states they interpret your "context" as "where you have lived and are living at the time of application". Has anyone had any experience living on a farm? I have lived and worked on a farm my entire life. Shanty Bay (the region in which I reside) is a major farming community, thus "rural". However, I don't know what NOSM considers "rural". Also, I've noticed (by what people post on this forum) that peope with research experience in a medical field get more favourable recognition by NOSM even if they have a lower GPA than most. Where can I find research opportunities? Are they paid, volunteer?

I'm sorry; I know I'm asking alot, but I absolutely need to get into med school.

[Wayward son]

Originally Posted by rkstrach

I need something to improve my context though. I know NOSM states they interpret your "context" as "where you have lived and are living at the time of application". Has anyone had any experience living on a farm? I have lived and worked on a farm my entire life. Shanty Bay (the region in which I reside) is a major farming community, thus "rural". However, I don't know what NOSM considers "rural".

I grew up on a farm myself. However, I am doubtful that NOSM will consider your location rural. That is just my opinion, as honest as I can make it based on what I know and don't know. Of course, none of us here has any idea what exact formula that NOSM uses to score context points. Many of us think that for people from southern Ontario something similar to the RIO is used. I would use your essays and ABS to sell them on your rural experience and desires.

Shanty Bay is just outside Barrie and would likely get the same score as Barrie on the RIO (Rural Index of Ontario): 8. Whereas Dryden (91), Red Lake (98) and Sioux Lookout (97) all score very high on top of being in Northern Ontario.

Rurality is not simply a matter of being in a location where the population is small. For Instance Temiskaming Shores has a population more than 10 times greater than Temagami which is just 30 minutes away. But the former scores a 74, and the latter a 66. That is because travel time to basic and advanced referral locations are used (and Temagami is 30 minutes closer to both North Bay and Sudbury).

So for instance living in a small community a couple minutes outside a large center is night and day different than living in Sioux Lookout or Red Lake where you have to drive 5 hours to get to a community which has more than 5,000 people. The former is a quiet area close to all the amenities you could need. The latter is very isolated. Although even people who grew up in Red Lake have nothing on knowing isolation when compared to someone who grew up in Fort Severn or Pikangikum where there is no road access, infrequent flights which are very expensive and you may have never seen a paved road, convenience store or a movie theatre until you head out for university (or leave home for high school, or are taken to a hospital in Winnipeg or Thunder Bay many hundreds of kilometers away).

Also, I've noticed (by what people post on this forum) that peope with research experience in a medical field get more favourable recognition by NOSM even if they have a lower GPA than most. Where can I find research opportunities? Are they paid, volunteer?

Hopefully, someone else can answer this. I have no experience with medical research.

I'm sorry; I know I'm asking alot, but I absolutely need to get into med school.

Don't be sorry. Those who ask questions are less likely to run into unpleasant surprises in the future. Of course, I don't think that anyone absolutely needs to get into medical school, although most of us, including myself, really want to get in. Best advice I can give is keep your options open so you can apply broadly throughout Ontario and beyond.

Of course by the time you are applying in a couple years things could also be different at many medical schools. NOSM used to use a weighted GPA, but dropped that a couple years back. I expect their admissions policies will change as evidence is accrued. In 3 years nothing may have changed. In 3 years everything may change.

[Real Beef]

Originally Posted by rkstrach

I'm sorry; I know I'm asking alot, but I absolutely need to get into med school.

Why do you absolutely need to get into med school?

[jojoluvsu2]

Originally Posted by rkstrach

Has anyone had any experience living on a farm? I have lived and worked on a farm my entire life. Shanty Bay (the region in which I reside) is a major farming community, thus "rural". However, I don't know what NOSM considers "rural".

I don't know for 100% certain, but I would say no a farm wouldn't count for what NOSM is looking for in a "rural" context. They're not necessarily looking for population, more so access to larger communities/resources/health care services. As was mentioned above, you can live in a little town of 1000 people, but if it's an hour drive away from Toronto (like Shanty Bay) that isn't nearly the same as a community an hour drive from Red Lake, or without road access at all.

[tb123]

First of all I think that you need to change your outlook on medical school. Seeing as how much farther you have to go before applying, you should focus on making yourself competitive at any school, instead of focusing on one. This is especially true of NOSM, where there are far fewer seats than qualified applicants. While NOSM may be your 1st choice, I would think your main goal is to become a doctor, not a medical student. Despite the fact I was born and raised in Tbay, I try and do as well as possible so that I can compete in any applicant pool.

There is really no way for you to improve your context, besides perhaps coming to LU a year earlier, and working in the north during the summer. Regardless, you will not have as good a context score as someone who has lived in a truly rural/ N Ontario for a long period of time. You should therefore focus on raising your GPA, something I doubt is as easy as you seem to think, unless you have been putting in minimal effort. Remember that the 3.72 average is for all students, and you will likely need higher grades if you do not have a graduate degree or do not qualify as a mature applicant, francophone, aboriginal etc. I'm in the same boat as you in this, and I don't consider it a bad thing, as we don't have the same life experiences, grades should form a larger component of our application.

As for research, the most important element if finding a supervisor who is willing to take a junior undergrad student on. Talk to as many professors and graduate students as you can, but realize that not many students have research experience before 3rd or 4th years. I attend one of the largest research schools in ON, and even here it is difficult to find even tedious work in a lab. Keep trying and don't hold out for your dream position.

At the undergraduate level, almost all research during the school year is unpaid, although it may be possible to receive credit. It is possible to be paid for research during the summer if you are able to find a supervisor and apply for a NSERC grant.

[Real Beef]

Originally Posted by tb123

First of all I think that you need to change your outlook on medical school. Seeing as how much farther you have to go before applying, you should focus on making yourself competitive at any school, instead of focusing on one. This is especially true of NOSM, where there are far fewer seats than qualified applicants. While NOSM may be your 1st choice, I would think your main goal is to become a doctor, not a medical student. Despite the fact I was born and raised in Tbay, I try and do as well as possible so that I can compete in any applicant pool.

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